forum: Chicken

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#31 Wed 09 Jan 08 11:55pm

mummza

Forum super champ
Occupation avoiding housework
From The land of song.
Member since Tue 04 Oct 05

Re: Jamie's Fowl Dinners

nicolesa, I think that you will find that I do care about animals but I am not sentimental about them.
I have been vegetarian for many years and these include years when I was about the only vegetarian in the place that I worked (then, a hospital, in the 1970's) and considered a weirdo .

I still beleive that humans were designed to eat meat and that we have both the teeth and digestive system to show that.

I still think that you saying that humans have '5lbs of rotting flesh' in their digestive tract at anyone time as a bit misinformed . I am sure that a gastrenterologist would agree with me . Few people will eat that quantity of meat over the time that food takes to pass through the disegtive tract.

I do not disagree that you think that being a vegan is a healthy way of life , however you would be advised to have your vitamin B12 levels checked everyso often as its easy to be lacking in this vitamin if you are vegetarian or vegan.

Last edited by mummza (Wed 09 Jan 08 11:57pm)

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#32 Thu 10 Jan 08 12:06am

nicolesa

Member
Member since Tue 08 Jan 08

Re: Jamie's Fowl Dinners

You mis-read my statement about the colon business...most meat especially red meat is not properly digested by the human body and literally sits in the colon and hardly passes through.  This is another fact I have read in various places; books, internet, doctors' research, health magazines etc. 

I am aware of the apparent B12 problem...we only need 2.5mg of B12 daily which can only be achieved through sea plants such as kelp for a vegan.  A few decades ago this would not have been an issue but unfortunately intensive farming methods, the use of pesticides etc has wiped out the vitamin from vegetables.  If only humans would stop destroying the planet hey??

I don't agree with eating animals in any form whatsoever or taking something away from them which is rightly theirs such as honey, milk and eggs (I'm sorry but how disgusting are eggs if you really think about what they are???) but I still respect people like Poet for at least being ethical in how he/she eats meat.  That's all us vegans really want - a bit more compassion and understanding.

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#33 Thu 10 Jan 08 12:21am

mummza

Forum super champ
Occupation avoiding housework
From The land of song.
Member since Tue 04 Oct 05

Re: Jamie's Fowl Dinners

nicolesa,
seeds and nuts will give you B12 , not just Kelp. You also get B12 from green vegetable but you would need to eat loads  and loads of them to get the required amount needed.
Lack of B12 in a diet is partly the reason that a lot of vegetarians and vegans become aneamic as the B12 vitamin is needed for the villi in the gut to be able to absorb the iron.
With inadequate B12 in a diet the villi flatten and the iron s not absorbed properly.

I am pleased that you are aware of the B12 issue, many vegetarians and vegans are not aware of it. This is the reason that I pointed it out to you.

If you give me the details of the doctors reserch papers that you read about the meat then I will read them and make an opinion. I don't think that I had misread your statement about the meat in the digestive tract as this is what you wrote.


'Humans on the other hand have an unbelievably long intestinal tract which is why all meat eaters have at least 5lbs of rotting animal flesh in their colons...hence colon cancer.  '

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#34 Thu 10 Jan 08 1:03pm

gardener

Member
Member since Thu 10 Jan 08

Re: Jamie's Fowl Dinners

When I was a child we reared free cockerels and had free range egg layers. There is no comparing taste, as long as they are fed quality food and looked after properly. BUT they are much much more expensive to keep.They run about and eat more food to reach the same weights as intensively farmed hens so cost much more per bird . That is why all the agribusinesses were able to force small farmers out of business, they just couldn't compete. Please remember in the 1950s chicken was a once in so often treat not a three times weekly staple. Also it is not so easy to keep birds outdoors in a British winter, they get cold, muddy and diseased without a lot of care. Many of you will not know that hens naturally stop laying when the days get short, so they have to have huts with artificial light to keep them laying all through winter- a hen that is eating but not laying costs money.
Yes lets have free range eggs and cockerels for eating but be aware it will probably still be the agribusinesses producing them and if they cut corners on feed stuffs or use inferior breeds the birds wont taste much better, and if they cut corners on animal husbandry the birds could end up being cold and miserable.( They are from SE Asia after all)
Romantics who think hens can be kept in a small garden are wrong. The soil soon becomes foul with ammonia and infested with parasitic worms red mites etc infest the chicken coops and after one year hens do not lay as many eggs. It takes a big garden and good animal husbandry to avoid cruelty and will never recoup the cost of wire and sheds but is a nice hobby.

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#35 Fri 11 Jan 08 2:43pm

lisa1young

Member
Member since Fri 11 Jan 08

Re: Jamie's Fowl Dinners

does anyone know of it is legal to own a couple of chickens to keep yourself if you live in a twon area, i would love to do this and try and live off ly own chickens eggs but i am just not sure if i would be breaking any laws by keeping these animals.

lisa

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#36 Fri 11 Jan 08 10:51pm

sarahhunt

Member
Member since Fri 11 Jan 08

Re: Jamie's Fowl Dinners

This is crazy what is it with you people. Jamie Oliver is stuffing his pockets with cash from Sainsburys whilst telling us what we should and shouldn’t eat.

If he really cared about chickens he’d not take his 1.2 million a year from this huge supermarket. Where does he think the money comes from to pay his contract….partly from mistreating chickens

It's hypocritical in the extreme.  Its like campaigning against land mines whilst being paid by a arms manufacturer.  How can you really call yourself a crusader for better chicken welfare when your paymasters are the ones committing the crimes.

Frankly its a joke.  If you live on 12,000 pounds a year buying free range organic chickens for 15 quid each is simply not an option.  I am all for improved chicken welfare, I just think it's the job of politicians and not self-appointed TV Chefs.

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#37 Fri 11 Jan 08 11:05pm

Mrs Gibba

Forum champ
Member since Thu 14 Apr 05

Re: Jamie's Fowl Dinners

Free range chicken does not cost £15 from the supermarket

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#38 Fri 11 Jan 08 11:36pm

Richard Loweth

Member
From East Midlands
Member since Mon 29 Nov 04

Re: Jamie's Fowl Dinners

sad  does anyone know of it is legal to own a couple of chickens to keep yourself if you live in a twon area, i would love to do this and try and live off ly own chickens eggs but i am just not sure if i would be breaking any laws by keeping these animals.
sad

What they are not telling you about is the rats that you WILL get.

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#39 Fri 11 Jan 08 11:41pm

Mrs Gibba

Forum champ
Member since Thu 14 Apr 05

Re: Jamie's Fowl Dinners

depends on if there are any covenants on your properties.  Lots of new build houses don't allow you, but there isn't such a rule on older properties - you'll need to look at your deads

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#40 Fri 11 Jan 08 11:44pm

saltedm8

Forum champ
Occupation Website designer
From Kent, England
Member since Fri 11 Mar 05

Re: Jamie's Fowl Dinners

Bugger me !!!

i have not ever had any mainstream tv programme create as many emotions for me as Jamie's fowl dinners has just done.

i was almost in tears ( not kidding ) as to how we are treating these animals,

don't get me wrong, i am no animal fanatic, i am not against eating meat, but if this sort of abuse was happening in your own back garden with lets say your dog for example, the law would jump on you and give you a dose of what you would deserve.

how can a government on the one hand tell you that you cannot treat your pets like this, when they condone farming like that ??!!  shocked

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