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#11 Wed 18 Mar 09 6:55am

The White Rabbit

Forum super champ
From Sydney, Australia
Member since Tue 22 Jun 04

Re: Elimination Diet Help

Allora Andiamo wrote:

...when you do a STRICT elimination diet, you usually have to stick to basic foods such as lamb, pheasant, carrots, potatoes and  pears for 2 -4 weeks...

the elimination diet I did didn't allow carrots in the base diet, as they are moderate for salicylates; the nutritionist added them after I did salicylates and was fine but i could only have 1 a day. That may seem odd but when all you are eating is potatoes, cabbage, rice and pears and the like it gets very very very boring.

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#12 Wed 18 Mar 09 7:50am

Allora Andiamo

Forum champ
Occupation Double Barrel Sheila
From Sauerkraut Country
Member since Mon 06 Oct 08

Re: Elimination Diet Help

The White Rabbit wrote:

That may seem odd but when all you are eating is potatoes, cabbage, rice and pears and the like it gets very very very boring.

tell me about it WR  hmm  son lived on lamb,carrots,potatoes, cabbage and pears most of the time and when he was allowed to eat his first grapes he thought christmas had  come early, bless 'im  lol

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#13 Wed 18 Mar 09 8:17am

The White Rabbit

Forum super champ
From Sydney, Australia
Member since Tue 22 Jun 04

Re: Elimination Diet Help

carrots...luxury...

It's very hard to do.

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#14 Wed 18 Mar 09 10:14am

Flib

Member
Member since Tue 17 Mar 09

Re: Elimination Diet Help

Thanks again for the comments, they've been very helpful.

On the subject of allergy testing; I can't justify paying £200+ for a practice which has many, many critics. If it was 100% proven then yes I could, but not when so much doubt surrounds it.

I'll schedule another appointment with my doctor and get him to refer me to a nutritionist. An elimination diet may be tough but it's just a scratch compared to what I've been through over the last 2 and half years so I can justify it smile

I may blog about it on here, I've never really done it before and need an excuse (especially as a computing student).

Dan

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#15 Wed 18 Mar 09 11:11am

The White Rabbit

Forum super champ
From Sydney, Australia
Member since Tue 22 Jun 04

Re: Elimination Diet Help

I'm not completely sure if skin testing indicates food intolerances. I didn't react to a gluten skin test.

Yes, forums and blogs are great procrastination from studying smile

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#16 Thu 19 Mar 09 2:47pm

sergio1972

Forum champ
Occupation NLP Trainer and Coach
From Portugal
Member since Tue 09 Dec 08

Re: Elimination Diet Help

Danny wrote:

Hi Sergio

It would be great to hear your thoughts as well....

Kind regards

Danny

Hi Danny, well in fact I was going to at first but then thought this was a bit out of my league.
I've worked in the health sector before for 7 years with supplements, etc. and my first opinion was that cow´s milk, red meat were to be eliminated from the diet and in short what I think Flib should do is go to basics, start from zero, increasing the amount of different things in his diet till he finally finds out whats causing all this.
I always like to help but experience tells me that cases like this should be dealt by people who have the knowledge to do it and as I said I dont, unfortunantely so the best I could say was what I did.

Cheers thumbsup

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#17 Thu 19 Mar 09 3:25pm

Sune Nutrition

Nutritional therapist (diploma from British College of Nutrition and Health) & professional chef
Member since Tue 03 Mar 09

Re: Elimination Diet Help

Hi Flib

Sorry to hear about your experiences and symptoms. Just a thought.... have you ever been tested for parasites? It sound like quite a few of your symptoms could be related. Not a diagnosis - just a thought.
My course of action would be to also ensure that you have sufficient HCl (hydrochloric acid) in your stomach, as well as to determine the need for digestive enzymes. If you are not digesting your food properly, undigested food particles could go through the gut wall. The immune system could see this as a 'foreign invader' and launch an immune attack.
I have had clients before; who after trying many different options (including eliminating wheat and dairy of course) I would do a stool test and discover parasites.

It would be advisable to find someone who can do a thorough case history and look at all the underlying factors. Food elimination as mentioned a few times on this thread can be very tiresome and inconclusive; not to mention the lack of variety as well as possible nutrient deficiencies.

Suné smile

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#18 Fri 20 Mar 09 8:00am

The White Rabbit

Forum super champ
From Sydney, Australia
Member since Tue 22 Jun 04

Re: Elimination Diet Help

Sune Nutrition wrote:

It would be advisable to find someone who can do a thorough case history and look at all the underlying factors. Food elimination as mentioned a few times on this thread can be very tiresome and inconclusive; not to mention the lack of variety as well as possible nutrient deficiencies.

Suné smile

The food elimination diet I undertook was done after all other possible tests and at the suggestion (in my case) of a gasto specialist. It was a testing diet and not designed to be permanent (in fact they specifically warn you not to attempt making it long term), and there were multivitamins to take during the time. It was a specific brand that they knew didn't contain any intolerance chemicals. For me the diet took a little over three months, but it can be more or less depending on your problem. It was run at a clinic that specialises in allergies and intolerances, you get referred by the allergy specialist and the dietitian runs the diet with you. Like I said to Flib before, it's something you need to have a suitably qualified health professional to manage with you.

http://www.cs.nsw.gov.au/RPA/Allergy/re … fintro.cfm

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#19 Fri 20 Mar 09 8:01am

The White Rabbit

Forum super champ
From Sydney, Australia
Member since Tue 22 Jun 04

Re: Elimination Diet Help

Sune Nutrition wrote:

My course of action would be to also ensure that you have sufficient HCl (hydrochloric acid) in your stomach, as well as to determine the need for digestive enzymes. If you are not digesting your food properly, undigested food particles could go through the gut wall. The immune system could see this as a 'foreign invader' and launch an immune attack.

I've not heard of this before Sune, is it something that is common?

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#20 Sat 21 Mar 09 10:51am

cookinlovebird

Forum champ
Occupation working
From West Midlands United Kingdom
Member since Wed 05 Dec 07

Re: Elimination Diet Help

Hi Flib

As promised


DEPARTMENT OF CLINICAL IMMUNOLOGY
Consultant: Dr Chrys Tsakona
Secretary: Roz Turner
Telephone/Fax Number – 01384 244855
SALICYLATE /AZOATE /BENZOATE - FREE DIET

We recommend that you follow this diet STRICTLY for 8 weeks and then gradually reintroduce back into your diet the foods you had excluded. Before you start it is essential to understand that by doing this diet for this limited period, your aim is to achieve remission of your symptoms sooner. If you think that your commitments make it impossible for you to follow this programme, use it just as a dietary guide. Please read carefully the following lines before you start.
If you know – before you start- that you are going to break it because of prescheduled events (holidays, birthday parties etc), wait until you have 8 weeks of uninterrupted routine and then start. If you are used to drink lots of tea or coffee, you may find the first days difficult, therefore it is wiser to start during a weekend, when you are more relaxed. Other members in your family (your spouse, partner etc) can benefit from it as well; so, why not do it together? When you introduce back the foods you have excluded, please do so gently (e.g. one new thing every other day) and make a note if your rashes or swellings came back after the introduction of a particular food. If this happens, leave this food out of your diet for a while. It is strongly recommended that you avoid the artificial food additives even when the diet is finished. Most people, however, feel a general improvement in their well being after they have been on the diet -obviously because of a healthier eating routine- and opt anyway not to return to their previous eating habits.
It is important to realize that you may still get angioedema and/or urticaria attacks whilst on the diet; this does not mean that the diet is not working or you are not doing it properly. It is a consequence of the fact that most artificial additives/food chemicals need at least 8 weeks to be cleared from the body. Please continue until the 8 weeks are completed and make sure you drink plenty of mineral water. If you are concerned about your weight, the good news is that, although there is no restriction in the amount of food you can have, most patients have reported weight loss and fewer no change in their weight. This is probably due to the fact that the variety of foods is -by some people’s criteria- rather limited and the intake of fat is cut down dramatically because of the exclusion of processed foods.

The medications mentioned at your consultation (Aspirin, NSAIDs and ACE inhibitors) that you should avoid are listed at the back of these pages. They may be brand names, proprietary names or drugs contained in any other preparation. Should you have any problems please speak to you GP. You can take safely Paracetamol, Cocodamol or Codydramol as painkillers, any non-aspirin based blood thinners and any non-ACE inhibitor as anti-hypertensives.


The diet sheet is based on current information available on the composition of foods. Food products are divided into two sections:

FOODS TO AVOID – often tinned and packaged convenience foods: these contain ingredients that may aggravate your symptoms.


e.g.    Salicylates can be added during the processing of foods but also occur naturally in certain foods, particularly fruit and vegetables.
NB. Aspirin contains salicylates. Ask you doctor about suitable alternatives if you need to take a blood-thinning product.

Azo-dyes which are used as colourings in the food industry. (Some foods may be coloured with natural colours and these are permitted)

Benzoates occur naturally in certain fruits, e.g. strawberries, but are also added to a wide range of manufactured foods as a preservative.

It is important that you DO NOT take any of the foods listed in this section during the 8-week trial period.

FOODS ALLOWED – these foods are free from azo dyes, salicylates and benzoates.

·    They can be taken freely, unless a recommended amount is given.
·    If a food/drink product does not appear on the diet sheet, it is best to avoid it during the trial period.
·    Try to base your diet on permitted fresh foods, taking as great a variety as possible to ensure you still have a well balanced diet.
·    This diet sheet has been written taking into account the dietary habits of the mast majority of the people in this country. For example, “beef burgers” refers to pre-prepared burgers; if you make them at home using allowed ingredients they can be moved to the “allowed” list.

Gradual re-INTRODUCTION OF THE EXCLUDED FOODS after the 8-week period:
We strongly recommend that you re-introduce gradually (e.g. one food product every other day) as many of the excluded “good foods” as possible, i.e. the excluded fruit, vegetables, seeds, nuts and herbs. For milk, yoghurt, cheese and bread it is strongly advised to stick with organic brands; for any other products, including snacks like crisps, chocolate etc, you should choose additive-free brands (or organic if available, but not necessarily). Eventually, you should feel free to eat and drink anything you like, providing that the products you consume are chemical-free. Please note that the food manufacturers often state on the packaging e.g. “preservative-free” but then there are other artificial additives in the product, like flavourings, flavour enhancers or colourings. Therefore the aim is to leave any chemical, i.e. any artificial additive out.

If there is something you would wish to ask, please phone the Immunology Department on 01384 244855 and speak to Mrs Roz Turner. If it is necessary, Dr Tsakona will contact you as soon as this is possible.

Garlic, parsley    Most herbs: particularly mint, thyme, tarragon, rosemary, dill, sage, oregano, marjoram and basil.
Salt, pepper, tabasco, soya.    Vinegar, bottled sauces and pickles, mint sauce and jelly. Seafood dressing, Piccalilli, salad cream, mayonnaise, Soya sauce. Gravy granules, Bisto, Oxo / Knorr cubes, curry powder, turmeric, paprica, gram masala; all other herbs and spices.
Breakfast cereal, e.g. Weetabix, Shredded wheat, Ready Brek, Rice Krispies, All Bran, Bran flakes, porridge oats.    Maize cereal, e.g. cornflakes, Crunchy nut cornflakes. Cereals containing dried fruit, e.g. Muesli.
Yeast-free wholemeal bread and rolls (100% wholemeal).     White flour, wheatmeal flour, cornflower, cornbread, packet breadcrumbs.
Homemade cakes, biscuits, pastries made with wholemeal flour and permitted ingredients.    Bought cakes and biscuits. Cakes containing dried fruit, e.g. mince pies, fruit cake. Cake mixes, Marzipan. Packet cheesecake mix.
Wholemeal crispbreads, e.g. Rivita, Allinsons, Energen. Wholemeal cream crackers.    White cream crackers, water biscuits.
Biscuits, e.g. Tesco digestive, Prewitt’s wholemeal biscuits, Allinson’s Bran biscuits, wholemeal shortbread biscuits, McVitie’s digestive biscuits.    All other biscuits including those containing dried fruit, e.g. Garibaldi, and chocolate chip cookies.
Rice, pasta, sago, tapioca, arrowroot, barley, rye, oats and buckwheat.    Coloured pasta, semolina, custard powder, instant desserts, dessert toppings, packet trifle mix, yoghurt whip, sorbet mix, jelly and quick-set jelly.
Plain chocolate, e.g. Bourneville, Terry’s dark Carob (unflavoured), any organic brand of plain dark chocolate.    Milk chocolate and chocolate bars;fruit ant nut chocolate, liquorice, peppermints, sweets, pastilles and chewing gum.
    Coloured toothpaste. Liquid vitamin C preparations. Discolouring tablets for plaque on teeth. Coloured medicines and tablets.

FOODS ALLOWED    FOODS TO AVOID
Fresh or frozen meat, offal and poultry.    Burgers, sausages, meat pies and pasties. Tinned meat products, e.g. stews, pie fillings. Meat coated in breadcrumbsCooked meat products e.g. ham, bacon and corned beef.
Fresh or frozen fish    Smoked cod and haddock, kippers.
Tinned fish in oil or brine, e.g. tuna, salmon, sardines, mackerel.    Fishcakes, fish fingers, fish coated in breadcrumbs or batter, pickled herring. Fish tinned in tomato sauce.
Eggs    Scotch eggs, egg mayonnaise
Margarine, butter, low fat spreads, cooking oils, e.g. olive oil, vegetable oil, corn oil, sunflower oil (lard, suet and dripping).   
Dairy milk allowance ½ pint (300ml) – whole, semi skimmed or skimmed – do not exceed this.    Extra milk including whole, semi skimmed or skimmed, dried, evaporated, condensed; ice cream, creams, yoghurts, whey, coffee whiteners, milk substitutes.
1oz organic cheese (white) can be exchanged for a third of a pint of milk.    Cheese, especially processed cheeses and those with coloured rind, e.g. Leicester or Edam.
Peeled pears (fresh -preferably- or tinned in syrup) freely. You may also eat bananas, figs, lemon, mango, papaya and pomegranates in very small quantities.    All other fruits including fresh, frozen or tinned. Dried fruit, e.g. currants, prunes, raisins, sultanas; glace cherries and other canned fruit. Nuts – including peanuts, chestnut, and coconut; sesame seeds.
Poppy seeds, Brussels sprouts, cabbage, celery, chives, leeks, lentils, lettuce, potato, swede, beansprouts, bamboo shoots, mung beans, lima beans, soya beans, black-eyed beans, chickpeas, dried split peas. You may also consume very small quantities of asparagus, beetroot, broccoli, cauliflower, marrow, mushroom, parsnip and turnip.     All other vegetables fresh or frozen including carrots, onions, peas, mushrooms, corn. Tinned or fresh tomatoes and baked beans. Fermented bean curd, fermented soya bean.
Homemade soups with permitted vegetables.    Tinned or packet soups.
Gin, vodka, whiskey, water, soda water, springwater, mineral water, tonic water (Schweppes only), pure pear juice.Decaffeinated coffee, cocoa powder, Bovril, Marmite, camomile tea.    Tea, coffee, milky bedtime drinks, e.g. Horlicks. Coca Cola, tonic waters with the exception of the Schweppes brand, all fizzy and soft drinks. Fruit juices and squashes, wine, beer, cider, sherry, port, brandy, liqueurs, champagne, mint tea, peppermint tea, Vegemite, stock cubes and powders. All yeast-rich products.
Sugar    Syrup, molasses, caramel, honey, jams, marmalade.

FOODS ALLOWED    FOODS TO AVOID
Fresh or frozen meat, offal and poultry.    Burgers, sausages, meat pies and pasties. Tinned meat products, e.g. stews, pie fillings. Meat coated in breadcrumbsCooked meat products e.g. ham, bacon and corned beef.
Fresh or frozen fish    Smoked cod and haddock, kippers.
Tinned fish in oil or brine, e.g. tuna, salmon, sardines, mackerel.    Fishcakes, fish fingers, fish coated in breadcrumbs or batter, pickled herring. Fish tinned in tomato sauce.
Eggs    Scotch eggs, egg mayonnaise
Margarine, butter, low fat spreads, cooking oils, e.g. olive oil, vegetable oil, corn oil, sunflower oil (lard, suet and dripping).   
Dairy milk allowance ½ pint (300ml) – whole, semi skimmed or skimmed – do not exceed this.    Extra milk including whole, semi skimmed or skimmed, dried, evaporated, condensed; ice cream, creams, yoghurts, whey, coffee whiteners, milk substitutes.
1oz organic cheese (white) can be exchanged for a third of a pint of milk.    Cheese, especially processed cheeses and those with coloured rind, e.g. Leicester or Edam.
Peeled pears (fresh -preferably- or tinned in syrup) freely. You may also eat bananas, figs, lemon, mango, papaya and pomegranates in very small quantities.    All other fruits including fresh, frozen or tinned. Dried fruit, e.g. currants, prunes, raisins, sultanas; glace cherries and other canned fruit. Nuts – including peanuts, chestnut, and coconut; sesame seeds.
Poppy seeds, Brussels sprouts, cabbage, celery, chives, leeks, lentils, lettuce, potato, swede, beansprouts, bamboo shoots, mung beans, lima beans, soya beans, black-eyed beans, chickpeas, dried split peas. You may also consume very small quantities of asparagus, beetroot, broccoli, cauliflower, marrow, mushroom, parsnip and turnip.     All other vegetables fresh or frozen including carrots, onions, peas, mushrooms, corn. Tinned or fresh tomatoes and baked beans. Fermented bean curd, fermented soya bean.
Homemade soups with permitted vegetables.    Tinned or packet soups.
Gin, vodka, whiskey, water, soda water, springwater, mineral water, tonic water (Schweppes only), pure pear juice.Decaffeinated coffee, cocoa powder, Bovril, Marmite, camomile tea.    Tea, coffee, milky bedtime drinks, e.g. Horlicks. Coca Cola, tonic waters with the exception of the Schweppes brand, all fizzy and soft drinks. Fruit juices and squashes, wine, beer, cider, sherry, port, brandy, liqueurs, champagne, mint tea, peppermint tea, Vegemite, stock cubes and powders. All yeast-rich products.
Sugar    Syrup, molasses, caramel, honey, jams, marmalade.

FOODS ALLOWED    FOODS TO AVOID
Fresh or frozen meat, offal and poultry.    Burgers, sausages, meat pies and pasties. Tinned meat products, e.g. stews, pie fillings. Meat coated in breadcrumbsCooked meat products e.g. ham, bacon and corned beef.
Fresh or frozen fish    Smoked cod and haddock, kippers.
Tinned fish in oil or brine, e.g. tuna, salmon, sardines, mackerel.    Fishcakes, fish fingers, fish coated in breadcrumbs or batter, pickled herring. Fish tinned in tomato sauce.
Eggs    Scotch eggs, egg mayonnaise
Margarine, butter, low fat spreads, cooking oils, e.g. olive oil, vegetable oil, corn oil, sunflower oil (lard, suet and dripping).   
Dairy milk allowance ½ pint (300ml) – whole, semi skimmed or skimmed – do not exceed this.    Extra milk including whole, semi skimmed or skimmed, dried, evaporated, condensed; ice cream, creams, yoghurts, whey, coffee whiteners, milk substitutes.
1oz organic cheese (white) can be exchanged for a third of a pint of milk.    Cheese, especially processed cheeses and those with coloured rind, e.g. Leicester or Edam.
Peeled pears (fresh -preferably- or tinned in syrup) freely. You may also eat bananas, figs, lemon, mango, papaya and pomegranates in very small quantities.    All other fruits including fresh, frozen or tinned. Dried fruit, e.g. currants, prunes, raisins, sultanas; glace cherries and other canned fruit. Nuts – including peanuts, chestnut, and coconut; sesame seeds.
Poppy seeds, Brussels sprouts, cabbage, celery, chives, leeks, lentils, lettuce, potato, swede, beansprouts, bamboo shoots, mung beans, lima beans, soya beans, black-eyed beans, chickpeas, dried split peas. You may also consume very small quantities of asparagus, beetroot, broccoli, cauliflower, marrow, mushroom, parsnip and turnip.     All other vegetables fresh or frozen including carrots, onions, peas, mushrooms, corn. Tinned or fresh tomatoes and baked beans. Fermented bean curd, fermented soya bean.
Homemade soups with permitted vegetables.    Tinned or packet soups.
Gin, vodka, whiskey, water, soda water, springwater, mineral water, tonic water (Schweppes only), pure pear juice.Decaffeinated coffee, cocoa powder, Bovril, Marmite, camomile tea.    Tea, coffee, milky bedtime drinks, e.g. Horlicks. Coca Cola, tonic waters with the exception of the Schweppes brand, all fizzy and soft drinks. Fruit juices and squashes, wine, beer, cider, sherry, port, brandy, liqueurs, champagne, mint tea, peppermint tea, Vegemite, stock cubes and powders. All yeast-rich products.
Sugar    Syrup, molasses, caramel, honey, jams, marmalade.


hope this may help you ...by all means take a copy of this and show your doctor first!!

cookinlovebird smile

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