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#1 Thu 06 Dec 12 8:02pm

abdullahcohn

Forum champ
Occupation Occupied
From My House
Member since Fri 11 Nov 05

starbucks, not jumping on the bandwagan, I've alway hated the bastards

We all know about the Starbucks Tax dodge.
The excuse made for them is they are all at it.

But that isn't true.
What is th other coffee chain?
Costas.
They pay 15 million a year.
So it is isn't they are all a it. Starbucks is at it. It's main rivel, Costas is not at it. And al the small coffee shops and cafes owned and run by people like you and me are not at it.

I am not a communist. I am not against people making money and becoming very rich. The small cafe and coffee shops make theirs while they pay their taxes. And Costas doesn't let being a multinationa chain get in the way of paying its taxes. 15 a year is a lot more than starbucks 0 pence a year!

That isn't the only problem. They go on abou how they support fair trade to con idiots in t buyig their crap. But all bt a tiny % of what they sell is very unfair trade coffee. You an say slave Labour coffee.
Wile 100% of wat costas sell is fair trade.

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#2 Tue 08 Jan 13 11:55pm

Batdragon

Member
Member since Mon 07 Jan 13

Re: starbucks, not jumping on the bandwagan, I've alway hated the bastards

I had no idear what you were talking about so I searched for it on line. Starbucks are technichally doing nothing wrong. They are following the letter of the law. What it is pointing out that there is a loophole in the law and it should be reviewed so that multi national coprorations do not swindle the government and ultimatly us the tax payer, Though I will agree with you on the front of quality of coffe sold in starbucks, to me it is only slightly ahead of the dishwater sold from a vending machine, nasty tasteless brown liquid. If I made myself a cup of coffee that tasted like that I would tip it away and try to work out what whent wrong. Dont get me wrong, Starbucks are not the only company that seems to want to provide you with so many options for your coffee that it fills multiple boards up, but has totally lost the plot as to what coffee is suposed to taste like.

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#3 Wed 09 Jan 13 8:35am

mummza

Forum super champ
Occupation avoiding housework
From The land of song.
Member since Tue 04 Oct 05

Re: starbucks, not jumping on the bandwagan, I've alway hated the bastards

L_Cornfield , welcome to the forum  smile

Starbucks have been taking advantage of the tax loophole and they are not alone in this.
It's been in the media a fair amount and has been the talking point often on the telly. Starbucks being mentioned always as they are a multi national company that everyone knows.

I think they should pay taxes in what every country that they set up in , after all their's and other companies or people's avoidance ultimately costs the rest of us more money .

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#4 Wed 09 Jan 13 9:57am

Ashen

Forum champ
Occupation Why is the Rum always gone???!
From out to lunch
Member since Sat 07 Jan 06

Re: starbucks, not jumping on the bandwagan, I've alway hated the bastards

I think many don't realize that if you run a publicly traded company, you are legally obligated to do your best to maximize profits for the shareholders(owners) . Not taking advantage of perfectly legal avenues to minimise tax expense can get them  sued for incompetent management.


The Universe is alive and self aware. 
Need proof?
Look in a mirror.
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#5 Wed 09 Jan 13 11:55am

MsPablo

Forum super champ
Occupation Just being me
Member since Fri 28 Mar 08

Re: starbucks, not jumping on the bandwagan, I've alway hated the bastards

When you see the numbers, it is shocking.  Amazon apparently paid only 2.9 million on 332 million in profits for 2011.  Google is also listed at the top with Amazon and Starbucks as taking advantage of these tax loopholes.

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#6 Wed 09 Jan 13 2:18pm

abdullahcohn

Forum champ
Occupation Occupied
From My House
Member since Fri 11 Nov 05

Re: starbucks, not jumping on the bandwagan, I've alway hated the bastards

To be honest I don't think this is a case of taking advantage of loopholes, but rather a case of the inland revenue tolerating this, with a nudge and a wink.

If I were to set up a business with a branch here and a branch place else. Both very profitable. And then sent all my profits made here to my branch some place else stating "My branch here is paying my branch some place else for the use of my name so am not paying any tax here as I have made no profit here". And I also said, "I have given myself a lone, and any additional profit I make here is sent as interest payments to myself when I am some place else", would the inland revenue buy that? Would they say, "Oh fine boy, I am so sad you have not made any money in the fine country of ours, please continue to do business here".
Or would they say "Pay up! or we will raid your business, freeze your bank accounts, sell your assets, and lock your sorry tax dodging fat lard filled pig skin in jail ".

If this is completely legal, and what companies should be doing on behalf of their shareholders. Then We should all tell Costas StarBucks main rival who pay 15 million a year in tax in this country that they should think of their shareholders and stop paying a penny!
Also remember that Costas manages to pay all their taxes while selling better Coffee than StarBucks. Remember 100% of costas coffee is fair trade.

But None of this matters. What matters is taxes are here for a reason. If StarBucks is allowed to make loads of money here with out paying a penny in taxes by using the excuse that they have moved the money to a branch elsewhere, why can't the rest of us?
Why do any retailers here bother paying taxes when all they need to do is set up a office or shop some places else an send all their profits there as a payment to themselves?
My brother owns a small chain of shops here, would he consider doing that?
No!
Why?
Because he would get done!
What StarBucks did is not strictly and clearly legal loophole, if it was we would all be at it and starbucks would have been at it a lot longer than the last couple of years this coalition have been in power. And even if it was, Job of the bastards that rule us to close that loop hole before we have to cause force any more disabled people to commit suicide by removing their benefits. The Inland revenue should do one of two things, Either tell all the shops starbucks competes with, Costas that past 15 million a year in tax and all the small chains, and the individual shops to use the same perfectly legal tax dodge and maybe pay back the taxes they have already paid. Or claw back every penny StarBuck hasn't paid over the last 3 years.

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#7 Wed 09 Jan 13 3:14pm

MsPablo

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Occupation Just being me
Member since Fri 28 Mar 08

Re: starbucks, not jumping on the bandwagan, I've alway hated the bastards

Sorry for my use of the term.  I see what you mean.

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#8 Wed 09 Jan 13 3:20pm

Ashen

Forum champ
Occupation Why is the Rum always gone???!
From out to lunch
Member since Sat 07 Jan 06

Re: starbucks, not jumping on the bandwagan, I've alway hated the bastards

I wasn't passing a moral judgement on it , just stating the situation.. I certainly do believe that your government needs to look at how it structures its revenue laws.   retroactive legislation that claws back  would be a good place to start.


The Universe is alive and self aware. 
Need proof?
Look in a mirror.
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#9 Wed 09 Jan 13 8:22pm

Pakman

Forum champ
From Estonia
Member since Tue 06 Oct 09

Re: starbucks, not jumping on the bandwagan, I've alway hated the bastards

The "loop hole" was created by the ice holes that create the taxation regulations.....maybe it's there because of certain gains they may receive?!

How many times can a product be taxed? Do they pay a tax on the raw goods ie: cups beans, packaging, etc.? The taxes must be paid on the water, power, land etc. Then as well the sales tax!  To pay a tax on the profit minus all the other taxes and expenditures is ?????? To pay a tax just because you successful is????

Kinda like the French 75% income tax thing shocked

All I ever see is cuts to the regular tax paying person's benefits or public services offered to them. Never seen any pay/job cuts for "elected officials and subordinates" only more parties that the tax payer foots the bill for. That must be why they're called "political parties".....................

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#10 Wed 09 Jan 13 8:43pm

abdullahcohn

Forum champ
Occupation Occupied
From My House
Member since Fri 11 Nov 05

Re: starbucks, not jumping on the bandwagan, I've alway hated the bastards

I don't think  the government will do anything to the StarBucks and others like them. Instead to prove they are collecting taxes they will squeeze more out of the small businessman.

Costas and Starbucks are comparable companies. They both sell the samething and they are both multinational. The difference is one pays taxes here while the other pays makes donations to political parties here during elections.

Last edited by abdullahcohn (Wed 09 Jan 13 8:43pm)

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